I don't know why Obama would tax the shit out of people who are generating capital -- that's been my whole point. And the economy doesn't work like that. Giving bottom feeders unearned money won't push the value of the dollar up, and it definitely won't lower the cost of anything. Who taught you macroeconomics?

Name one thing that you feel is priced too high and I'll explain why it's priced that high in 1-2 sentences max.

Your guess is wrong, as the polls have shown that Obama and McCain are extremely close. If you're seriously suggesting that the rapverse.com community is a representative sample of the entire population, then you should really consider never talking about politics again.

Yeah, I got you man. I was more directing that last bit to the people who are coming in here like voting for McCain makes zero sense whatsoever, when that's not the case at all. Bush's incompetent ass is leaving which is definitely a good thing, but at least he kept taxes down, hahaha.

Oh, and for those of you who think Bush gave tax cuts to the rich, you should really double check your figures because that hasn't been the case. In fact, if anybody would like to see the statistics behind who actually received the tax breaks, let me know and I'll post up the figures tomorrow. "Bush's tax cuts for the rich" has been political bullshit the entire time, as the facts suggest something completely different.

McCain reads from teleprompters and scripts that he doesn't write about the economy because he doesn't know shit about the economy and he willingly admitted that.

so comparing Obama to McCain on anything that involves the economy is comparing (This Is My Shitty Plan) to (This Is The Plan I Don't Quite Understand, But Someone Who Does In My Campaign Wrote It And I Support It)

obama! O-B-A-M-A! We got this :D

but seriously @ whoever said that Sarah Palin was a dumbass choice for McCain.

earlier he's all like "I have way more experience than Barrack Obama. He doesn't have nearly enough to be President" etc. etc.

fuck it tho, he grabs a 2 year governor bitch to be VICE-PRES.

McCain is an ass fuck yo. At least Obama isn't stupid enough to completely ruin the lies he's told in the past by opposing them. Comparing Obama to himself in Experience then adding Palin to his ticket is just a kick in the face to any decent thinking American.

Woo woo down with the blackies, white power, vote mccain...

Forget the baggage, he knows about war and stuff.

You're not going to respond to what I said? The fuck did you even post for? Typical rapverse.

bro...who taught you econmics? Its common sense that if you give people money, most people spend it.

By givin money to lower income families, its goin to put more money back into smaller business's...and smaller business is what the economy needs.

Look @ the stimulas package....i'm not sayin that it did really anything spectaular, but it did help, regardless of what anyone says.

N what are you talkin bout? how is a higher dollar not goin to push prices down? Thats why prices are up, is because our dollar is so in the fuckin tank.

So please do explain....

--1 more thing, we have no middle class ne more...so until they figure out a way to make a middle class again...America will continue to be fucked.

^ If you give lower income families money they aren't going to be putting it into smaller businesses, they'll be emptying their wallets at Wal Mart and Taget and everything else they're used to going to once a month instead of three or four times.

Regardless, fuck the war, fuck McCain.

fuck representative government :)

there's only one way to fix this nation, and that's to make the citizens law makers. (People actually count as One.)

instead our best hope is to get on the street with a picket sign, call up some buddies and drink beers as the time passes us by and nothing happens :o

Sooo umm.... i'm Canadian :thumbup:

There's no difference between giving bottom feeders unearned money and letting the people who earn the money spend it. What the fuck is the difference? I know that people spend money. I'd rather see people who earn the money spend it then fucking bottom feeders. What kind of retarded point is that? "People spend money, dude!!" Yeah, the argument isn't whether people spend money or not, it's who's going to be spending the money -- people who earn it or people who don't.

Your point that prices should be down is moot and insignificant. Okay, so somehow the value of the dollar goes up (which will NOT happen as a result of taxing the people who generate the capital and giving it to low income people), and then prices go slightly down. Who the fuck cares? The prices will still be the same relatively, in that your $100 will still be able buy EXACTLY what you can buy with $100 now. What problems does that solve?

The actual prices themselves are determined by the market, which is determined by supply and demand. If you want gas to be $1 a gallon adjusting the value of the dollar won't do shit because it'd still be the exact same relative to how much money we have now, and what the value of the dollar is now.

We're not in a recession. Our economy isn't even bad right now. Taxing the people who generate capital won't make any difference at all in adjusting the value of the dollar, so your entire point is incorrect and shows a complete lack of knowledge of macroeconomics. The value of the dollar is determined, like everything else, by supply and demand, but capitalistic economies need inflation, so the supply keeps going up (which is a good thing). Giving money to low income families doesn't do anything with regards to the value of the dollar.

Sorry to rain on your parade.

voting just encourages them

Oh, and yes, there is a middle class. Stop watching Lou Dobbs for a few minutes and actually think about it.

lmao

okay Mimesis, if thats even your real name, you suppose that we try trickle down economics one more time? cuz, u know, thats worked SO well in the past, and thats basically your suggestion.... and why exactly do u expect unemployment to swing back to 5%, (and btw, someone who thinks unemployment, as you said, Should be anywhere but 0% has some serious problems) you think that it will just fix itself? that it will just go away? what great logic you have there, i must commend you

the reason the Palin pick makes McCain a bad pick for President is the simple fact that, ding ding ding, it reflects his Judgment... when he does a Huge bellyflop for his first Major decision, how can u expect him to make good ones after that? They had one actual conversation with her the day Before she gets chosen, and they say she was properly vetted? I dont know if its worse that she was taken with such haste, or the fact that they actually think she Wasnt taken with haste, either way it reflects really poorly...

and thank you for, u know, not actually responding to anything i said...

the woman wants to teach No Evolution, and only teach abstinence
... now i understand if she doesnt Believe in evolution, and in using contraception, but it should be taught to Everyone, even if it is suggested by teachers which they prefer...
oh yea, ms abstinence has a pregnant 17 year old unmarried daughter... but Oh no, thats not an issue..... the thing i hate is when i talk about her daughter, or anyone, we arent bashing the Daughter.... we are bashing Palin for not even being able to convince her own daughter of her beliefs and legislation....

btw, your Campaign Manager has been quoted saying that this election "is not about the issues" but its about the composite image of the candidates and who are perceived as better leaders.... thats one great thing to say, he doesnt think it gives a flying fuck what the people want as long as they can ride the "McCain is a Maverick War Hero Train" all the way to the White House..... i almost loved as much as being called a "Nation of Whiners" by the McCain camp.... really lovely

Now, you think McCain will change the country? that he will steer us in the right direction? He couldnt get passed Bush in 2000, and then after that agreed with the President 90% of the time while he was in office... so basically the country wouldve been in the Same condition had he gotten elected 8 years ago instead of Bush.... McCain has been in Congress over 20 years, and as much as he thinks he's a Maverick, and thinks he is a Washington outsider, he's not.... he's too old, too stubborn, too grumpy, and hot-headed, and been part of Washington way too long to achieve the change that we honestly Do need.

as Obama said very accurately... its not as if McCain doesnt care, its that he doesnt Get it, he doesnt Know.

Are you the biggest fucking idiot that ever walked the earth? No, my real name isn't Mimesis, what the fuck hahaha? My real name is Austin, but you can address me as sir.

You have ZERO knowledge of macroeconomics, and anybody who has the most elementary, fucking worthless foundation of knowledge EVER will say you're an idiot. Unemployment will NEVER be at 0%. I say it will go back to 5% because that's the natural rate of unemployment. Do you even fucking know what unemployment is, or who's considered unemployed? That was a rhetorical question because if you did you'd understand why it can never reach 0%. I know it will correct itself because I understand macroeconomics, something you obviously don't know shit about.

I'm not going to address the rest of your post or any future posts from you until you start talking about shit that's actually relevant and makes sense. NOBODY is saying that unemployment will just keep rising until it fucking reaches 100% or whatever your trying to suggest in your worthless and idiotic attempt at explaining a basic macroeconomic principle.

McCain is old and Palin is conservative. What a fucking shocker. I stopped reading your post after the first paragraph then skimmed over the rest on my way down to pressing the Quick Reply button. Your arguments aren't worth the 5 minutes it takes me to read and reply to this shit, so just please stop posting. You're a fucking retard. Get out of my thread. Oh, and learn how to type too.

Seriously, can an Obama supporter come in here and tell this fucking moron that the natural rate of unemployment is 5% and it'll never be 0%? Jesus, maybe if somebody who's on the same "team" as this dude told him he's wrong he wouldn't ramble on for multiple paragraphs, miraculously not making one decent point.

ROFL.....sure there is. Sure, there...is.

Prove that point.

Mim's is right, there is always suppose to be some type of unemployment.

fuck yeah 2v!!! Lets take 5 steps backwards and live in caves n fuck women with hair on their face's.


Get the fuck outta here with your whiny bitch bullshit....go post something else about the magnificent hurrican that is gonna whipe out the human race

Can you prove there is no middle class? The last time I checked, according to you, there WAS a middle class, which means you're making a claim that now there isn't. You're making the claim, which means the burden of proof is on you. It's not up to me to disprove every wild and asinine claim that comes out of Lou Dobb's retarded ass show.

thats a horrible statement bro....Mccain agree'd...just like the other 98 percent of the senate/congress. You can't single out one dude.....


Mccain was indpedent in 2000 anyways, so if anything...he was a much stronger canidate back then...than before he joined the Republican party.

ROFL...i dont watch Lou Dobb's


I was just tryin to make the point that the middle class is shirnking....and if anything. It will be the downfall.

N if you want me to try and prove it, go to your local WIC office...or Food Stamp/Food Bank


the lines are growing...more people are findin it acceptable to live off the state and goverment...why? They aren't middle class anymore...

I only mentioned Lou Dobbs because I know he wrote a book about how he thinks the middle class is being pulled apart. I don't think it's really a problem right now though.

I don't even know how this shit got pulled in this direction. I said I didn't want to taxes to be raised, then I explained my point, then Mannie comes here rambling some bullshit and now we're here. Hahaha, oh well.

Me looking at people standing in line to get food stamps isn't proof that there's no middle class. It's just proof that people want food stamps. I don't know if more people are cashing in on the government's free ride, though I don't doubt that to be true.

But, how do you explain the high amount of people still living in houses in decent neighborhoods, still working, still paying for their own shit, etc.? I mean, I know a lot of people lost their homes in this foreclosure disaster, but people who knew what they were doing kept their homes, and didn't go into debt. I guess I'm a little unsure about what you're defining as middle class because what I consider middle class still exists today.

lol, n how many of those families do you really know?? Many people have lots n lots of credit card debt. Just because they are holding on, doesn't mean thats it ok...


I remember when i was younger, bein able to go do things....like go to the lake, or take trips...that shit dont happen ne more with alot of kids i know now, due to the fact of higher gas prices/living expenseses.....


although we might not ever agree on who is gonna get into office, or policies or ne thing


can we agree that times are much harder now than before?

this isn't a solid argument simply because none of us have been around long enough to really see what's going on outside of our little world, through multiple presidencys...i think shit used to be a lot easier..because i would sit and watch cartoons and play outside all day. Now i take classes like political science and international economies...and see that shit isn't as good as it could be. i don't feel like its worse...allthough...in 10 years i'll probably feel like it's better or worse....i can't do that right now.....because i'm too young to have personally experienced the pros and cons of our different states of economy and social welfare

actually his over 90% agreement with Bush is higher than most of his republican colleagues, so no its not a horrible statement...

and first off mimesis, you cant take a joke u dumb fuck, obviously mimesis is not ur real name, do u think Mannie Fresh is my real name? get real

and if u read correctly, i never said it was Possible to put unemployment at 0%, i was simply making a little jab that its counterintuitive to say unemployment Should be at 5% instead of should be erased or as low as possible... ur over here saying "its good enough if we just get it to a steady 5%"....especially considering in the 90s the unemployment rating had dropped for 7 years straight, and was under 5% for three of those years, including almost hitting 4%.... and btw presently there are over 60 countries with lower unemployment ratings... including a few that Are at 0% last time i checked, although im sure u can argue whatever u want for the reasons they are capable to do it and we are not, being undeveloped and what not... which brings up my point that i dont know what America u live in, but i live in one where u hope one day we can get rid of unemployment, or decrease it to a non-concern, not just throw it to the waistside cuz u feel like its impossible to even get it below 5.

and thank you again for answering any of my actual comments...... u know, i appreciate wen u Say u wanna talk about issues, and then never discuss them... cuz i still dont understand how u think unemployment will go down with no work put towards it... and if u give that same reagan trickle down bullshit just with different wording, than u obviously dont know your history too well

and to Pinky, i didnt Single him out per se, i was simply making the statement that when he agreed that much with a president that took us done the shithole, how can we expect him to be better? how is he a Maverick? how will he be a reformer? because if he had been president those 8 years, by logic, it wouldve turned out over 90% the same way.....

[QUOTE=Mannie Fresh]actually his over 90% agreement with Bush is higher than most of his republican colleagues, so no its not a horrible statement...

and first off mimesis, you cant take a joke u dumb fuck, obviously mimesis is not ur real name, do u think Mannie Fresh is my real name? get real

and if u read correctly, i never said it was Possible to put unemployment at 0%, i was simply making a little jab that its counterintuitive to say unemployment Should be at 5% instead of should be erased or as low as possible... ur over here saying "its good enough if we just get it to a steady 5%"....especially considering in the 90s the unemployment rating had dropped for 7 years straight, and was under 5% for three of those years, including almost hitting 4%.... and btw presently there are over 60 countries with lower unemployment ratings... including a few that Are at 0% last time i checked, although im sure u can argue whatever u want for the reasons they are capable to do it and we are not, being undeveloped and what not... which brings up my point that i dont know what America u live in, but i live in one where u hope one day we can get rid of unemployment, or decrease it to a non-concern, not just throw it to the waistside cuz u feel like its impossible to even get it below 5.

and thank you again for answering any of my actual comments...... u know, i appreciate wen u Say u wanna talk about issues, and then never discuss them... cuz i still dont understand how u think unemployment will go down with no work put towards it... and if u give that same reagan trickle down bullshit just with different wording, than u obviously dont know your history too well

and to Pinky, i didnt Single him out per se, i was simply making the statement that when he agreed that much with a president that took us done the shithole, how can we expect him to be better? how is he a Maverick? how will he be a reformer? because if he had been president those 8 years, by logic, it wouldve turned out over 90% the same way.....[/QUOTE]


lol, ok first off, bro....i'm a huge Obama supporter...so right on with you, ya dig?


N you obviously did single him out, n tried to make it seem as if he was the only one who agree'd with Bush. Hell, everybody agree'd with Bush....i did, i thought goin to war was the right thing to do.

David Letterman said it best, that America felt like it NEEDED to do something in retaliation. Kinda of like, if a guy push's you...n you don't push back, but if someone told you that he also fucked your g/f, than you'd fight back.

I feel like Mccain, could have been a great president. He was on the right path in 2000....but after alinging with the Republican party, for whatever reason he did....i feel as if thats when he became less of a Maverick and more of a Motherfucker.

People can call Mccain some war hero, which ...i suppose he was, but really...he was more or a less a POW that came home. End of story. He aint Patton. He aint some great general...those motherfuckers were hero's...not some POW who got his story published.

Mimesis, it kind of seems like you're voting McCain over Obama because of one issue. And even then, the people who do get to earn extremely large sums of money SHOULD be taxed more, because they are living the "American dream".

Living in this country allowed them to reach those heights, so it's only right they pay it back in the end. If someone makes a million dollars and half of it gets taxed.....they are still fucking rich. If half of that being taxed means that underprivileged people can have more opportunities to reach heights similar to those being taxed, I don't see why that's a bad thing. It's like if your mom raised you to be a good kid and always made sure you had the best opportunities possible, and then she got old and needed help, wouldn't it be right to make sure the people who made it possible get something back?

Yes, there are those who take advantage of the system, I see it every day at work when people with food stamps buy $100 in junk food and every time financial aid checks come out and people I know go out and buy Jordans and new rims for their car. But at the same time, there are people out there, including me, who if it weren't for the extra opportunities given, wouldn't be able to do anything but work 2 jobs to barely make ends meet. To put that into perspective as well, it's not like because there are girls out there who will cheat on you and use you, that means that ALL of them do. When you start acting like that, resentment gets built up on both sides and nobody goes anywhere. Get me?

Just my 2 cents.

I'm voting for McCain for a few reasons. The strongest belief I have in this election is that taxes shouldn't be as high as Obama wants to make them. I'm a firm believer in capitalism, and Obama's tax policies are coming close to bordering socialist. If Obama said he wouldn't raise taxes to outrageous levels I'd definitely consider voting for him.

Dude, I already explained this on the second page. I'm not talking about the top 1-3% of this population in terms of income. I'm talking about middle class people. Of course if you're making $50 million a year and the government takes half you should still be fine (though that's not always the case, but if you can't manage yourself with that much money, you're pretty much an idiot), but that's not the income bracket I'm talking about or arguing for.

I don't believe if you work hard to open a business or do something innovative that you should be required to give back half of your income. If you're already creating jobs and generating capital, doesn't that provide the "American dream" to other people? If I open a successful business and hire you, aren't you better off then if I hadn't opened a business and hadn't hired you? What's a person's motivation to put in the required work to open a business or do something innovative, create jobs, and generate capital if the government is going to take away half of it and give it to people who don't necessarily deserve it? That's why socialism will always fail. There's no motivation to work hard.

Your analogy about a person's mom isn't accurate and doesn't sum up this situation. I'd present a counter analogy but I can't think of one that covers everything I'm saying. It's just your analogy fails to factor in the good people who start businesses are already doing, both for the economy and for other people. It's not like the country gave me a bunch of opportunities and I turned that into a good thing for just me. The people who I'm talking about have given back to the country and continue to give back to the country everyday (via jobs, goods and services, taxes that they're already required to pay, etc.).

I get what you're saying and I respect the hell out of you for doing what you're doing, and I wish you the best of luck. I just can't support raising taxes very high, and that's the main reason I'm not voting for Obama.

i agree with most of this and i do think the obama hype is bigger then his actual ideas but.......................if mccain goes into office he will keep this ar going ad most likely attack iran who will bomb isreal to gt back at us since they are our closest frends in the area.taxes will still go up because the war wll cotinue regardless and the country will fall furtherand further into debt.taxes wilbe bad eithr way.i'll take the taxes with obama and no war over war AND taxes ith mccain.

That was the worst attempt at a cause and effect argument I've ever read.

He will "most likely" attack Iran, who will "most likely" attack Israel, and then that will "most likely" lead to taxes being raised, and that will "most likely" drive us further into debt?

Seriously?

bored.........................

lol

i almost wanted to say, good point CALI...until i read more than the first sentence


Mim's....he does raise one interesting point. Mccain on a global scale....compared to Obama on a global scale. Fuck dude, Obama drew 200000 people in GERMANY....thats fucking insane

He is way way way way way better diplomat than Mccain could ever be.

But what do you think?

we would'nt need such a great diplomat if our presidents would stop picking fights with everyone.even the u.n don't agree with us nomore.mccain will piss everyone off and start world war three if he don't die of old age first

U almost had a correct statement

you just should have said, we need a great diplomat more than ever, becuase obviously the old way of doing things isn't working anymore. Being a bully to other nations, and tryin to push people around is only making other countries more pissed off @ us. Making us isolated on the global stage more and more. Obama on the other hand can fix this.

Yeah, I was starting to think CALI was going to say something legit, but he managed to drive himself into the ground.

I'm not sure who would be a better diplomat. Neither one of them has had to convince foreign leaders to do anything yet. Obama seems to be more popular in foreign countries, but that doesn't necessarily translate to be being a better diplomat. He could be, though.

Like I said, the main reason I'm voting McCain is because he won't raise taxes. The debate about who's going to be a better diplomat isn't one I'm very interested in because I don't really feel very strongly one way or another.

We aren't on the best of terms with the UN right now because Bush is incompetent, but that doesn't mean their frustration will still hold when McCain or Obama get elected. I couldn't tell you though, I'm not very well read on our relationships with foreign countries, or who has the better foreign policies.

i don't thinkanyone can fix it but at least obama will try.