fa shizzle my nizzle

"shizzle nizzle.."..

.."do you know what that means.."..

.."..er, no....".

..."..you were right to run when lost in gutter Harlem..."..

"...that's what it meant?! Shut up!.."..

"...*shakes head*..yes, i will.."....


How it spreads...

i meant that in the snoopesque sense of the word

Thanks for clearing up my statements, I do not see how he did not understand my position or arguements. Opey has laid it down a plain as day, now it's up to you all to consider both sides of the equation. Opey is correct when he stated that the majority of the news we base our positions on are liberially biased. The university has become liberally biased, the elite academics are too, on the far left. Most average households are blinded to this, we are being force feed this far left agenda in our homes, in our schools and now in our churches (not all but many have become liberal on more than just social issue's).

Lets just reduce this arguemnt to it's simplest terms, for someone uninformed (as you said I was) I sure know when I am being manipulated and force feed erroneous information. Unilke yourself, who has blinders on, or simply a bandwagon liberal.

Reduced to simplistic terms:

Ok the left wing believes the worlds biggest threat is global warming and other enviornmental issue's.

(I am a part of the scientific community and I agree this is a concern, but not the largest threat to our world today. Also the scientific community is split on this topic, many disagree!)


The right wing feels that the largest threat to mankind today is exactly the same threat 100 years ago, 1000 years ago, and has been the same throughout history. That threat is the one I am concerned with, "human evil".

Now human evil has been mankinds largest and most visible threat as far as history goes. I do not understand why the left has a disassociation with evil. They do not admit to evil, perhaps because it's a contradicition to most of thier ideologies. Not all left wingers but far more than a few tend to associate ignorance with a person of faith. To acknowledge evil in the world one would have to associate good or God. Now there is no way the ACLU, a liberal orinazation is going to allow that. The ACLU is on a quest to remove God and or Religion from public view. Not just on the rotunda of Roy's Rock, but from the hearts and mind of the public. They start early by contaminating our children with their one sided teaching in the public school systems. Not all states but in california, the left coast ,it is so visable. The left believes in bigger government, involved in every social aspect of life. Now that is right along the lines of communisim, why can't more people see that? I feel it's because many do not care, do not understand, or have been lead astray by the agenda of the left wing.

Going back to the largest threat as seen by the left and the right, I hold human evil to be the real threat. If we allow a shift in power in the middle east, our existance will be nullified, human evil will prevail, and global warming will be far less of an issue. Don't get me wrong I care about the enviornement and have dedicated much time and work on enviornmental issues. I just do not understand how it is our most critical issue. Stablity of the middle east, and eleminating our dependency on Suadia Arabia, are far more critical.

If you have been to the west bank, spoke with isreali officials, seen with your own eye's the devistations inflicted upon those citizens of Isreal, then how can you argue against my points? I contradict myself? I am sorry but the only one contradicting thierself is you my friend. I have been solid on my stance in every discussion on this board or the hundreds of others I contribute to. I have seen many war zones and atrocites I wish never to have witnessed. I take both side of the equation and apply logic, not emotion, before I take a side or voice an opinion. I do not comment on something I have not researched endlessly, or have studied aggresively. I am not one sided or closed minded, I wieght each and every issue ethically and morally, I do not rely on the media, or do I trust everything printed in the news papers. I am a researcher by nature and career, I do not listen to only one side of any arguement. As you have claimed I am ignoring half the issue at hand. Well exactly what half of the issue are you refereing to? Care to explain, because your post was easily contradicted, and my points were obvious to others, but not you. I wonder why? Please enlighten me, what half did I ignore?

^^man you have a hell of a lot of time on your hands.
You should do topicals, you'd be good at them

^ I wish I had time on my hands, I am so busy in every aspect of my life, career, family, politics, friends, band, and every now and then I sleep. I remain active and keep my self current on many issues, as a parent I have to be involved. So I do not have the time you may think, I just manage the time I do have well.

What's the topicals about?

^^Ok bounce, I agree with you 100% on the fact that human evil is the number 1 threat. But tell me, how is it possible to deal with that threat????Human evil, as you have said has been, is, and always will be the biggest threat in the world, because, we do not live in a utopia. No society in the world lives in a utopia, and until a utopia is created, there will always be human evil. And at the same time, human evil is the reason that a utopia will never be maintained/created.

^^lol gotta work on my word choice, but what do you think?

the only thing we can do is what we are now doing. there is no right answer. there will always be human evil. we have to keep fighting it tho. sometimes human evil prevails and sometimes it doesnt. we still have an obligation to keep that struggle going.

qoute


"all a person can do is what they can with what they have, dispite human greed and evil, in the time they are alotted"


ties in with opey


" war isnt the first step, its the last, and most dreded" Dwight D Eisenhauer

^^^ for all of those who think the US is out for a good fight

^ truley the words of a wise man @ opey


The battle has been on going as far as recorded history, it is always going to be an issue. There is no completly right or wrong way to address the issue, but to ignore it, now that 's where the problems come into place. If we just sit back in our lazy chairs and watch football, oblivious to the mounting tensions and threats to humanity, then we have failed. Not only as a nation, but as a people! We can not afford to fail the people of this country or any country in this aspect. We can not allow those nations, organizations, or people to go unchecked. We need to make an agressive stand against human evil. I know people will argue our involvement is just as evil, but with this type of 'war' comes trade offs. We will never have a utopia, but does that justify the abuse and mistreatment of people because this is not a perfect world. I feel it is the responsiblity of the strongest to protect those in need. We are in a better position than most countries, so I feel it's a responsiblity of this country. It is a sworn duty of every administration to uphold and protect the people's freedom rights and interests. Against every possible threat and advisary, by direct or indirect means. Iraq is a classic example of indirect means. Most see it as greed for oil, but if you look deeper into it, winning independence from the Sultans in Saudi, protects our people in more ways than one. I too feel the oil was an issue, but from a well planned tacticle stand point. Sure freeing a people was good and just, but creating an Iraq where the people can prosper and at the same time disolve some of the dependencies we have on Saudi resorces, it's pure genius. Once the Iraqi economy and infulstructure is stabalized we will have a friendly government at the helms. One in which the people can prosper from, not just the old regime. We have an alternative source in which to buy our oil from, we then no longer need to play by the rules of Saudi Arabia. Which in turn will prove to be a heavy blow to the terrorist operations in that nation. We can move forward without our right arms tied behind our backs, and fight this battle against human evil with a new footing. It's all a trade off, but you must consider both sides..

Much respect to all...

Bounce Religion, Politics and sometimes Sports are all moot points, we're all entitled to our opinions and most of us keep them. Opey im involved cuz I stand by my beliefs and I voice them in there as well, one thing I definetly agree with bounce on is da respect, but its good that we talk bout this shit even if we think each other is wrong....Much respect to all

Bounce, you are my idol, as should more americans take piece of mind from your words, america has gone and forgot about being people as a whole and making progress and advacing everyday to make life better, but people would rather worry about themselves then the well-being of a fellow countrymen, or rather a person. All people see is what the press wants them too, and by their assumptions, making assumptions like the ones made here about iraq and every conflict are plain ignorance and stupidity, people need to reilize that they dont know whats going on and what are the options, people need to stand up, even if they disagree with our leader, for our country and respect and honor his/their disicions. Materialism is taking over the people of the united states, snd if it countinues our great nation will crumble, as did others such as Romans, Byzintines, Arabs, Great Britain, all of those were once great and powerful kingdoms, countrys, empires. They all fell because people only cared for themslefs, and not for echother...


..resp..

Aimed @ emotion

^ You're right to an extent, but many are unwilling to listen to both sides. Most care to push their foundationless ideas around without commiting to debate or discusion. As you can see I am willing to discuss, and I do have an open mind. It's just sad that so many people are being fooled into thier stance. If you present a good enough arguement then I would be the first to admit my I was wrong. I have been wrong in the past, when I was myself had the liberal wool pulled over my eye's. I too once felt passionate for the left, but then I grew up and actually studied, researched and gathered information, which has open my eye's to the world today. I only said your misstatement of facts were wrong, I never said your opinion was wrong. Just founded on misrepresentation that's all. I respect you opinion as much as everyone else's, I just want the debate to be factual. Many democrates have agreed with my arguements, but still get a bad rap because of thier parties affliation with those on the far left. I respect waht the democratic party stood for a life time ago, but today it has been inundated with the ideology of the far left. I mean communism has proved to work in a small community but for a nation, we have all witnessed the collapse of communist regimes. I repect the ideology behind it, but in today's world it just does not work. I do feel the far left with its big governemnt and social interests are approaching that of communisim. I know it's exagerated a bit, but none the less that is the direction if we allow it.

What ever happened to the American pride our fore fathers fought and died for. What ever happened to believing in something so strongly you'd die for it. If it wasn't for those brave souls who unselfishly gave thier life for thier nations our freedoms would be non existant, and I am not just talking about here in the US... Once again the worlds most precious resource is our youth, we must protect that resource at all costs, your's or mine.... American or Iraqi, it does not matter, our youth deserve a world enviornment where they are free to live learn and prosper.

God bless our youth....

Heh. It wasn't in reference to you saying it. Just a general thing...

Everyone, nice discusion today, let's keep these threads active, and try to understand eachother without upsetting one another.

My time here is over for today, but I hope we can make some use of these types of discusions. It's positive from all respects to have debates, together we can look deeper into the issues surrounding our every day lives..

Much respect to all,


and no I'm not like a hundred years old like most of you claim, Im in my twenties, and have plenty more years left of them. (twneties that is)

Interesting statements here, took me waaaaaaaaay to long to read it all but was entertaining in the least. I would like to say, non argumentatively, that The States is not disliked for its liberties granted to women though. I think if Americans really want to know why they are despised they need to start asking people outside of America to get a more accurate account. Im not going to tell you in here, as Ive discovered some of you don't like to hear what I have to say.

Regarding international Aid, Id like to propose a question -
On one side of the table we have a man who earns $400 a week income and he donates $100 dollars of it to charity each week.
On the other side, we have a man who earns $4000 a week income and he donates $1000 of it to charity.

Who is giving more?
Obviously, if we want to look at the actual figures, subject #2 donates more right? - Well, obviously..
But in all reality, when relatively speaking, the amount that subject #1 donates is far greater.

It's like a pop star, who earns millions each year donating $5k to some charity and recieving praise for it, but when a single mother donates $50 to a charity (a far greater sacrifice on a single mothers income) it is considered less simply because of its monetary value.

good point TOURNIQUET, we only recognize thos who are always in the spotlight, rich and famous, why dont we recognizing those who sacrifice part of their paycheck like in the example TOURNIQUET gave us? and like bounce said earlier about those who died unselfishly for the freedoms we take forgranted today, why arent they remebered? why dont we stand up for the rights and freedoms we have, even tho at the moment their is no major threat (us people who use the press for information)?


..resp..

ponder that for tomarrows arguments and debates

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!

that math is fantastic! in actual figures #2 does give more but relatively they are both giving THE SAME! LMAO $100 is 25% of $400 and $1000 is 25% of $4000. lol where did u go to school?? and LMAO @ bsquared agreeing with him HAHA

/\ yea lol what he said

Jesus, you missed the point altogether.

It is intentional that they both donate 25% of their income, as it leaves subject 1 with $300 to survive on, and subject 2 $3000 to survive on, illustrating that even though subject 2 donates more, relatively speaking (ie when compared to how much they actually earn) subject 1 is making the greater sacrifice. Pointing out that percentages are indeed a factor, and that actual figures aren't always the only consideration.

You know, a wise man once said it's better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt.

i think ur missing the point. no matter how u try to explain your reasoning, your argument is not even close to being logical. why don't you read my previous post about the comparison beween national budgets. i clearly explain the reasoning behind this. your argument is simple and illogical. u are simplifying our national budget into a simple equation which in itself is false. you couldnt even back up your elementary mathematic logic with a correct answer. Infact you are so off base i refuse to restate the huge post that i already typed tonight.

... a wise man once said "if you don't know what you're talking about, shut the fuck up." actually i said that but i think it applies

opey, how is that not logical???

its not logical because the country with the more money (ie. USA) has more expenses. I already listed the expenses but the biggest reason is a MUCH LARGER population to take care of. we also have a large government and many government programs. the more money you have, the more money you need. and thats not just greed. if you dont think we give enough money to international affairs consider the fact that we are spending $10 billion a week on our campeign on Iraq alone.

you can think about the percentages like this. you work for someone and make $2000 a week and give $500 of that to charity. I run my own business and make $4000 a week. I give $1000 of that to charity. I give more cash but it appears that we both give the same percentage of our money. but you are forgetting facts in this equation. You work for an employer and keep all your earnings. meanwhile I am running a business and have to invest half my earnings back into the company to cover all the different expenses that go along with running a business. Now I am making the same as you but giving twice as much. now who is giving more?

this obviously isnt exactly the case with government but you should get my point that outside cercumstances effect goverment spending more than just a simple 7th grade math question. you have to take everything into consideration when seeking an answer or else youre just left with a one sided opinion that makes no sense

good point, didnt reilize or think about the other side of the equation...



..resp..

^^ive heard that "who gives more" question asked a million times, and I must say, having read your logic and opinion on the subject, that I disagree.

No disrespect intended, but I think that the person who makes $4000 a week gave more, simply because the more money one makes, the harder it is for them to part with this money. Honestly, I don't think I can really expand more on this. That's just my opinion.

But on a side note, much respect to b-squared for making this thread, and to bounce, opey, and everyone else who is participating in this discussion.

yall should read Machiavelli's The Prince, it would shine lots of light on this topic



..resp..

^wow brand-o


your getting popular



hahahaha

well its better than being popular by being an herb ;)


And that..........is word

no comment...

LMMFNBAO AT BRANDON



YEAH OKAY WELL NOW YOU KNOW YOUR PPUL-R <LIKE THE SPELLING


WELL IM ALMOST AS PPUL-R AS YOU

i aint ppul-r, but other than that, once again no comment...

like bounce said earlier, about those who died unselfishly for the freedoms we take forgranted today, why arent they remebered? why dont we stand up for the rights and freedoms we have, even tho at the moment their is no major threat (us people who use the press for information)?


..resp.. [/B][/QUOTE]


any one gunna answer that???

I don't see how Machiavelli relates to this...

In fact The Prince has nothing to do with this

^ my thoughts as well

Bounce, your an intellegent man, and i know the topic of the price does not fit with this thread, but if you look deeper into the piece within the main message of the writing, it does infact shed light on the topic of this thread, what does america mean to you, and what would you do to preserve it. I suggest re-reading the piece Bounce, i think you will inderstand my meaning.



..resp..

America has us brainwashed, we are not free, especially black folks. Look....I not here to make this racial. but check it....

If you say fuck the police, do you not get a beat down/and or jail time. But hey We have the freedom of speech...right?

The government is free to do whatever they want, we are not. They can lie to us, but if you lie to the court, they will take your freedom away.

They say it's wrong to kill, but we just destroyed a smaller country for nothing

Hitler, used the same tactics, he said the countries he conquered were a threat. When he conquered too many we had to stop him.

They brain wash us, they say yeah your free, you can do anything go anywhere anytime, and that's bullshit. Everysince 9/11, our "freedom" has been severly comprimised. They can do anything they want to you, if they suspect you are a terrorist. Tap your phone, raid your house, pull you over, tear your car up. Just like the mob, the government has a hand in everything.
Alcohol, was illegal peopel went to jail, and died in prohibition. Now it's legal, so those peoples lives were ruined for nothin. Now Weed is illegal, and the gov't has a business plan that if they do legalize it, they will control it. Yet weed is not addictive and doesn't ruin people s lives such as alcohol abuse.

The job market is kaput, but the rich are getting richer, while the poor get shitted on. Funny how SEC of defense Rumfields, defunct construction company, go the first Billion dollar contract for construction in Iraq.

Canada is a free'er country than us, I mean look at their gov't. They have free health care! I mean we're the richest country and our health care just doubled. If my girl get's in an accident today (God Forbid), her hospital bills will plung her into a life long debt, she can never repay. Because her insurance jumped from 186 a month to 525! Thats about half her monthly gross. and it's INSURANCE meaning that dough is for nothing if she doesn't go to the doctor. THANKS BUSH!

Legend you know I don't hate, but please leave the US! (then come talk about our non existant freedoms) Now Canada is a great country, I do like it, but if it did not share a border with the US, it would have a new flag, like IHOP has pancakes...^ Now that is word!!!!

Please don't bring that weak ass arguement in here, it's the same one everyone uses, it's a fucken bastardized force-feed liberal-misconception. The distribution of wealth in this country is directly proportional to Educated in this country. The left is on a mission to disolve the middle class in this country, what does that remind you of? You want to talk intellectually, then please let's analize things from both perspectives..


Move to europe and recieve your free health care, or go to canada, since when is it the responsibility of a Government to provide health care, get a life, a respectable career and your health care will not be a concern. Please people don't you understand bigger government means less privacy and freedom, where were you kids durring history class or the fucken cold war?


WTF?????????????????????????????????/

^^And the right wing is working for the middle class?^^

I would say, the right wing is the middle class, now are they beign represented in the political arena today, barely. Like I have always said, I do not support everything the current administration is doing, but I see it aa a much smaller threat to family values and security than any other party of influence. The republican need to pull thier heads out of their ass and start worry about something other than elections, they need to stand for something again. I mean right now they are wiling to trade off votes over policy, look at the mess in california. There were two qualified Republican canadites in the running, but the party is willing to back a lesser canidate in Arnold, just to secure the office. You know what I rather cast my vote for someone and their policy and lose, than back someone just because they can win... So yes politics today have me in a rage!!!!!!!!!