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Rap is poetry(especially for dopium)
A good poem helps to change the shape and significance of the universe,
helps to extend everyone's knowledge of himself and the world around him.” -Dylan Thomas When I think of this philosopher's remarks about poetry, something like a treatise on aesthetics comes to mind. At a minimum,I expect a rigorous examination of the characteristics that define “poetry”,the differences between kinds of poetry (epic, tragic, lyric, comic, and so forth). The senses in which poetry is and is not bound to representation, imitation, expression ,all possible connotations of the classical Greek word “mimesis” , as well as fiction. These complicated terms themselves require careful definition. Equally penetrating and systematic remarks about the small differences between poetry and other art forms, especially rap music, would be in order, as would reflection on the relation between orally delivered poetry , and poetry communicated through the written word. |
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I dont disagree with you,but rap is a form of poetry.There is no doubting it.
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Comparing poetry to rap is like comparing the hi-ten mitsurugi style of swordsmanship with the goten karusami style of swordsmanship. They can appear similar, but have very different subtleties and roots.
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Thats a a good example,but I strongly feel to deliver rap music in its original form,you need a poetic stance.
Im not talking about what you may call rap music (50 cent,g unit and all that generic bullshit) Im meaning real rap music,hip hops rap music. It is all pulled from a poetic form,we are rappers here to tell our story in a respectfull form. Rap when broken down to its original format,will and allways be MY form of poetry. I see my self as a philosphical poet who is about to clash with what you might call comprehensive world views,it seems what are matters and of grave importance to me are ethics, politics, metaphysics, theology, and epistemology are all expressed in my music,which is reached from a poetic form,but translated thru rap music. So I guess, it comes back to one personal veiw on what they see there OWN music as. I am a poet, my raps to me are poetry. Which nostradamus so blatently tried to tell me I am not :bored: |
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Well I guess you can take the element and form your take on it. Rap, to you, could indeed be a form of poetry. Its a bit of a generalisation to say rap is poetry. Those artists you mentioned dont have anything to do with rap in my eyes. Its just pop music. Even underground artists might not be poetic. But some may be, and some may see rap as poetry. |
yeh I feel that bro. Im mainly trying to stress the importance of ones personal view. Your dopium partner in crime blatently tried to make me think my veiw is wrong,and what ever I think isnt correct.
So therefore I thought I should once and for all express how deep my mind acctually runs and how I feel my point of veiw is correct. I am willing to listen and take others into account, I am not willing to be told how wrong I am by some guy who claims to be the second coming of nostradamus.No hate nos,but you gotta learn to chill,cause bro Your not allways right. |
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Well when he rocks up im sure he'll have something to say. You should probably at least listen and open up to what hes trying to put across. |
Every Topical I've Written Could Be Concidered Poetry
... Because I Write With A Very Poetic Style, It's Simple Entangle In 'Rap' Flow. I Have Actual Poetry Written Here On The Site ... Click The 'Atticus Prophet...' In My Sig It'll Take You To My Links If You're Interested. |
Ysdat; I take my rap very seriously.. I dont slip up when I'm giving opinions and anything I have said I would stand by 100%..
Rap is not poetry. It would be clear enough to most people when OMB made his point about when rap first started, the dudes who made it were more into reggae and rap was what they used to host parties. You think Kool Herc was speaking emotional poetry when he introduced well known members of the crowd at his partys? That my friend is the birth of rap itself. Furthermore, do you feel NWA was being all deep and poetical when they wrote the lyrics to famous RAP songs like "FUCK THE POLICE" Or for a more recent reference, when Eminem was dosed up on MDMA caps writing stuff like "I'm cancerous, so when I diss, you wouldnt wanna answer this if you responded back with a battle rap you wrote for canibus".. Was fucking poetry on his mind brutha? I'm trying my hardest not to sound condescending as you obviously have it in your head that I'm working against you, not to mention telling me to chill out after immediatly taking up an overly defencive stance in the other thread, creating a new thread based on the small argument that I forgot even happened; and making comments like this one: Quote:
Which was mildly humorous and ironic to me considering that statement itself is basically, 100% wrong... Rap is a form of music, as much as you hate it; 50 Cent & G-unit are successful rappers, you said it best yourself that everyone has their own opinions.. However saying rap is poetry is attempting to steriotype what 'real' rap is considering how many raps simply have no relation to poetry even in the most abstract analysis. When you look at rap on an industry level; the artists that sell, are always the ones that speak a clear message using language people can understand, I have been given this advice by plenty of knowledgable people when talking about hip hop. Poetry on the other hand, is words describing feelings, emotions and thoughts that can serve as a reference to certain feelings, emotions and thoughts that the reader has experienced, that is why a poem one person will love, can be complete garbage to another (like I said in the previous thread, one mans trash is another mans treasure). Poetry when done correctly, is not something that is designed to be implemented into rap or music for that matter. Sure you can write a poem and then make a track with the same meaning. But you wouldnt straight up use the same wording as in a poem simply because poems have a different set up and approach to rap as a form of music. And for anyone who says "hey I'd use my poetry in rap songs" Your either: A - Never going to hold a successful rap career. B - Not writing proper poetry. Ysdat, I invite you to post one of your verses that you feel is very poetical and would make a killer rap song at the same time... I'm sure its possable, but straight up saying rap is poetry is very ignorant to every other style of lyricism that rap implements to build up this form of music. I dont try to come off as a know it all.. But I'm definatly not a bumbling fool that pretends to be smarter than he is. And for future reference, here is the most major (among other) contradictions you made while arguing here. Quote:
Might I also make note of my paragraph on kool herc and the origions of rap in this post here aswell, funny how raps 'origional form' differs from what it is in reality inside your head. I'm done now. You would have to be hell bent in revenge mode if you further this argument and attempt to be-little my opinions in order to disagree with anything I have said. I'm a philosopher myself Ysdat; opinions and the study of the way things work are my game... And you wont beat me at my own game, I dont talk unless I know exactly what I'm saying. |
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that's not true...I've written a poem and re-worked it into a song and gotten great feedback from it...rap and poetry are NOT one in the same, but some people can make them stand side-by-side together, it's MY belief that the peson to do this best was Tupac...some people refer to him as a "thug poet" and I believe that's true...to me, poetry is something that conveys images through words and causes you to "feel" through those words whether stated aloud or in written expression... like I said, the 2 are not the same, but they CAN coincide...a person can have a poetic rap style...50Cent and other rappers as himself rap in a more "straight forward" approach but others that use more metaphors and imagery rather than being boastful, seem (to me) to be poetic with their wording...an example of this would be someone like Talib Kweli... and it's not about underground or mainstream, it just so happens to be that the mainstream is less opposed to the straight forward approach because it sells better and people that don't listen to rap will understand it better than a person that truely appreciates the actual wording of a Talib Kweli, rather than the hard beats a 50Cent rap on with a braggadocious swagger... it's all about preference, but like I said, the 2 can be related... |
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Pac still wrote poetry, then wrote rap tracks with the same meanings to suit what he was talking about in his poetry. Your right, it can be done to good effect, I was probably a bit harsh on that front.. But rap is still not poetry.. And there are a lot more styles than just commercial 50 cent music and deep poetrical meaning songs..... When I say rapping with straight up language.. I actually didnt have 50 cent on my mind... heh.. I actually had eminem, dre, eazy e, tupac, Louis Logic and rappers of that calibur.. But word... |
YES!! I have influenced a young mind, wOoOoOo!! lol
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Influenced me?
How old are you btw? |
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^ Isn't that the guy that spits hot fiya? |
I'm 22 (almost 23) years old Nos...
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Oye... Im 19...*shrugs*
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I say Rap is a Form of poetry....Just like R&B songs are....Its A way to express yurself through verse....Yu cant say that because the artist isnt rhyming deep or wahtever, taht it isnt poetry....There is no ONE WAY to write a poem.... Therefore, Yu cannot say sumone isnt writting it "properly".....unless its completely off....like yu writing a novel or sum shit like taht
It has nothing to do with wehn Rap was born .vs. when Poetry was born....Becuase its true Literature was born well before, Yet poetry is a form of it.... Quote:
^incorrect sweety POETRY(only a few definitions of it..to counter taht statement) -Prose that resembles a poem in some respect, as in form or sound. -A quality that suggests poetry, as in grace, beauty, or harmony: the poetry of the dancer's movements poetry it can be abstract as aswell Bottom line is:...POETRY DOES NOT HAVE A CONCRETE SET OF GUIDELINES....and RAP DOES fall into a catagory of Poetry....its a genre of it...despite the content...cuz i've read deep/on the surface poems... |
Well shit, guess what everyone..
According to arktic frost. Fictional books are poems... Conversation transcripts are poems... Movie scripts are poems... The bible is a poem... The Quran is a poem... My msn name is a poem... My rap name is a poem... This button under my post saying "Post quick reply" is a poem.. Where does it end? Poetry must have guidelines to define the nature of poetry itself. The definitions you gave imply this clear as day and prove my point. I have said poetry can be used as a form of rap, however in no way does rap fall into a catagory of 'poetry', that is obsurd.. Look at lyrics that brag and mess around.. As quoted in part of my other thread some of my rap lyrics that have no relation to poetry at all: I'm a metaphorical erasor, slash you with a razor. Till a warm gash of blood grubs the face of. Some gay cunts; & thats the case study done. So fucking run; I got another gun thats my other lung. You bloody nuns; I'll give the crowd what they came for. Pick a straight whore; rip her brains raw with a chain saw. Still remain all; ruthless to leave ya crew toothless. Like two kids; acting stupid in a booth with. The illest rappers around; quick damage ya town. With hammers that pound an activist down. You cat'll be ground, by my rhyme morter and pestle. On-board with the best crew, dopium all gonna test you. And yeah; I'm at it again; back like an addict with pens. Smackng ya friends; with these raps that offend. When you try and explain to me how this rap fits into the catagory of poetry. I will give you a cookie........ My point remains true to what I've been saying this whole way through.. Poetry can be used as rap to a certain extent, but acting like rap is a form of poetry is naieve as hell.. Oh hey, by the way "As in form or sound" Is refering to being vocally spoken. Not instrument/s playing with a drum beat... |
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^i never said that yu fuckin idiot...READ MY STATEMENT CAREFULLY Quote:
-see taht is exactly why people like yu shouldnt comment on topics taht require thought... |
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Is it just me or was that effin hard as hell to understand? :huh: but yeah.. rap for sure is poetry.. |
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I read your post exactly how you wrote it. If you meant something else than what I replied to. Word it better "yu fukin idiot..." You said poetry is an expression and has no guidelines.. The button under my post is expressing to me that I can use it to post a reply... My name is expressing metaphorically my interest for the future, a conversation transcript is expressing the feelings of speaking participants, the bible... ha, you tell me what thats expressing.. I think you know exactly where I'm comming from.. |
oh and nos.. poetry is also sed on drum beats.. Last Poets.. looked them up ;)
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But the poetry itself isnt in the drum beats dude... ................................:mad: |
lol... yeah but its sed over a drum beat :) hahaha... ahh w/e.. i dont care if poetry isnt rap or is rap.. i still luv rap.. woo hoo IM COOL!
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it doesn't have to be on the beat itself to be considered rap or poetry...rap is believed to be a FORM of poetry in many, if not MOST circles...
poetry has a natural flow, so does rap poetry eXpresses feelings or views of the individual, so does rap poetry contains imagery and word twisting, so does rap poetry contains metaphors, so does rap therearemany more similarities I can go on and on about...but honestly, every aspect of rap is also found in poetry, they are VERY related... |
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^vokally spoken?....is that NOT waht RAP IS???.... Quote:
^how is it naive??....its a fuckin genre of poetry.....Just like...yu got different genres of literature.... |
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I'm not gonna bother replying to arktic frost as the lady got no idea what shes babbling on about.. But yeah, this is true.. They can be related, but rap is still in itself, its own art, its a myth that rap is simply just a form of poetry. Contrary to what some hip hop heads believe, rap is not only about lyricsm... Rappers create music. And certain styles of rap have nothing to do with poetry... You know what I'm saying? Relation - yes Under the catagory of poetry - hell no |
at the core in it's ORIGINAL form rap is a DIRECT reflection of poetry...there is darker more morbid poetry that can be considered along the lines of the style that Eminem (whom you afformentioned) raps in...not everything that's classified as poetic has to be something soft...there are so many aspects of rap and poetry that are the same, the only real difference is that rap is performed directly to the pattern of the beat itself...to me that is the ONLY difference in the two and that does not mean that rap is rap and poetry is poetry...rap is a FORM of poetry at it's core...no matter what your content is... does that mean every rapper can write poetry and every poet can rap?...no...not every rapper can write without it being to the pattern of an actual beat in order for it to be a rap and not every rapper can NOT write to a beat and have flow without a beat moving them... but rap is STILL a genre of poetry...just like movies...not everyone can do horror flicks, some people do dramas, and vice versa... |
If Rap was Poetry...why are they called different things!
Krunk has similar elementa of hiphop..it is not HIPHOP...that is why it is called Krunk.. |
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My lord.. Honestly.. You can justify anything if you try hard enough.. Quote me a poet that has said they want to rip some brains raw with a chain saw.... Those definitions our friend arktic frost posted said it best: -Prose that resembles a poem in some respect, as in form or sound. -A quality that suggests poetry, as in grace, beauty, or harmony: the poetry of the dancer's movements A quality that suggests poetry.. Saying you want to rip brains raw with a chain saw does not in any way suggest poetry, nor resemble poetry... Rap is NOT a genre of poetry... My god woman.. A horror movie is a genre of film because it entirly falls into the catagory of "movies" If styles of rap can be employed with absolutly no poetical aspects, such as afore mentioned verse... How exactly can rap just be a form of poetry.. Rap is its own art form...........I'll say it again Rap is its own art form........... It has aspects that make it relate to poetry, but overall, rap is a form of MUSIC..... The origional rap, as stated by myself and OMB earlier in this thread is fucking hosting partys and giving shot outs to well known people in the audience... thats where rap ORIGIONATED FROM...... Not from a poet trying a new form of poety... PLEASE. Do I really need to keep going? Sorry if I seem agitated... I'm tired, its late... You know... |
music is notes arranged in a pattern...
rap is "lyrics" and lyrics are defined as a form or "poetry"...whether it be that the person is singing or rapping them... and Acuity, "krunk" is a genre of rap just like "gangsta" rap is...it's still all rap... P.S. I'll be back in here later when I get home, I'm leaving class now... |
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Lady is there ever a point where you actually try and understand what a person is saying rather than just scrambling to make a post contradicting them and remaining right in your own mind.. Rap is not all about lyrics.. I used to think that too untill I realised the importance of making your tracks ACTUAL SONGS that include catchy hooks and well placed dubs and samples.. Not to mention that word a lot of rappers dont understand at all "melody"... (not saying you dont understand melody though I anticipate you would get that comment twisted if I dont make this clear to you) Freestyling is another big part of rap that poetry has nothing to do with... The culture of rap battling... The art of beat making and sound mixing... These are all considered elements of rap music as a whole.. Like I said... Saying rap music is just all a form of poetry is obsurd.. And I have said in the past rap isnt all about lyrics why do I need to say it again? Please examine carefully what I've said before you write the next post... Not to be rude... I just think your overlooking a lot of fundemental points I'm making in the heat of 'trying to prove me wrong'.. |
I dunno, I don't think rap is poetry. Rap is alot more upfront about feelings. You never see a poet say exactly what he means obviously. Angelo said, :I know why the cage bird sings". You ever see a rapper say that? I think rock is alot more like poetry for its lyrics. Rap is almost like a competition and there's actually a skill level involved. And you can't have a poetry battle.(off rv that is :bored: )
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Actually the roots of hip-hop come from African poetry... Sooo.......... |
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Hip hop started with names like Kool Herc in NY back in the 70's who experemented with djing and hosting partys, and by putting together little freestyle rhymes, he would entertain and intruduce guests to his partys.. People built on it from there and today it has turned into a genre of music called RAP............ Not a genre of poetry... Not a form of poetry that is some how left out of all poetry books and texts as being a known style of poetry.. People gotta be kidding me saying rap is just a form of poetry... Shit is insane..... I'll say it again... Relation - Yes Rap being 'just a form of poetry' - Fucking hell no |
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I was just talking about origins... Obviously rap and poetry are different... |
Well yeah.. I dont think your correct in raps origions being based in african poetry.. You can make connections all day, but it was Kool Herc that origionally looped some samples with a beat and rapped over them..
Thats rap... And yeah no accusation or nuthin... I just know that certain people would jump on your comment and act like that one statement proves their point when it doesent.. |
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^poetry is a form of liturature(fact..look it up)....and its called Poetry...not literature.....rap is a form of poetry.....bottom line.... |
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You my friend, are seriously thick.. Rap is a genre of music... Ask if this is true ANYWHERE, they will agree it is a genre of music. Ask any well known publisher of poetry books, if they will include rap songs because you believe rap is a genre of poetry.. They will look at you like your a fucking idiot.. Bottom line...... |
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