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Old 11-11-05, 08:23 PM   #1
Terumoto
I have a lot to learn...
 
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Posts: 9,740
From: Life.
An explination of suffering, provoked by my other thread.

IP:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daubs
So you mean, you look up to a figure that everyday murders innocent people, causes them lifelong pain, and thats not even going near the third world countrys,

I just cant dig it mate.


This is a different issue to what I was talking about... Im not a christian, but I think I understand christianity and why they believe it, probably more than most christians do.

Its hard to explain... (ill be taking a christian perspective for this and talking as if I were a christian, to make things easier.)

God doesn't murder innocent people or cause them life long pain.. and the situation in third world countries isn't his fault. God gave humans freedom, right? So how can you blame God if a human invention, like a car, kills your friend? How can we blame God if some guy rapes and murders an innocent teenage girl? God gave the rapist freedom, and although tragedies deeply hurt God, it would be stupid for him to stop all suffering.

Its a nice idea, but if God changed things to prevent suffering, it would probably result in even more suffering. If God put an end to the big sinners like Hitler, pol pot etc, that would make terrorists, armies etc the worst sinners. If God put an end to those, it would make rapists, murderers etc the worst sinners. If God put an end to those people, it would make drug dealers and shoplifters the worst sinners. It would just keep going until something like everyone who tells a lie dies instantly, and everyone who thinks about a girl sexually when they arent married dies. Its just not practical. And you might say "well why doesnt he just not kill them, but change the events?" .. Same thing.

Say a guy was playing golf. The people in front of him were taking a while, and he had to be quick to get to a meeting. After he showered and shit, he goes out to the parking lot and because he's in such a hurry, he runs into an old lady. The old lady falls over, hits her head and dies. Is that guy a murderer? Shouls god have changed physics so that she had a soft fall? Should God have hurried the guys in front of the golfer, or made him take a longer or shorter shower? If God intervened in every instance that caused suffering, there would be no constants or free will in the world.

My last point is that even if suffering was Gods fault, it shouldnt affect a christian. We deserve it. God could kill 3 billion people for no particular reason, and in no way would it be morally wrong. Consider this scenario:

A crowd is at the gates of heaven. Many of them are overcome by God's immense power, knowledge and wisdom, and God judges them rightfully. But a lot of groups of people up the front are heated... Questioning the validity of gods right to judge them. A girl pulls up her sleeve, and there is a tattoo of a number. She says "God doesnt know suffering... I was experimented on, saw my family and friends die around me... I was killed in the concentration camps, just for being a jew." A black man pulls down his collar and reveals a mark on his neck. "God is a sheltered God... how can he know the pain we have all felt? I was lynched for no reason other than the color of my skin." A 40 year old woman pulls up her shirt and reveals a stab wound. She says "I caught my son stealing and doing drugs.. He said he didnt want to be my son anymore, and stabbed me. God doesnt know what it feels like..."

There was an uproar. All the groups, the jews, the blacks, the ones with mental or physical disorders, the murdered, the raped, the innocent, the diseased etc... They all sent forward a representative, chosen because they had suffered the most. The representatives collaberated and thought of an idea that was quite clever. Before God had the right to judge them, he had to go through what they did.. Each group shouted out a part of Gods sentence.. "God should be sentenced to live as a human! He should be born as a jew to know that pain! he should be alienated from others to know that pain! He should be ridiculed! He should feel how hurtful it is to be forsaken by something you created! He should suffer a long painful death, and people should make sure he's dead! He should know what it truly feels like to be alone!" After the last representative finished shouting their part, there was a long silence... They realised that God had already served his sentence.
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Do you understand where im going with this? "the lord has given, and the lord has taken away." - Job something verse something... You cant not believe in God because you've suffered. It makes no sense. And daubs, i recall you were a christian before that accident...

any queries, let me know.
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