What are people's thoughts on this kind of thing?

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Right.. Well my 'thoughts' on it are basically that we can in no way ultimatly prove that this is in any way a logical explenation of what follows on after death.

Therefore, all we can do is speculate on hypothetical possibilities if it were to be the case.

I think one of the main problems with this theory is simply that our population is in a constant expanse. However this is only a problem when looked at concepts such as time from a narrow human perspective where we only deal with the steady constant of the 'now'.

I believe the afterlife will naturally exist outside the boundries of time, therefore the fact that we have an ever expanding world population is not to say there are new souls, because 'past' lives figerativly speaking could be souls from future times spawned at this particular point on our world line for reasons beyond our ability to comphrehend.

And furthermore, we should definatly explore the reasons as to why this theory might have come into being in the first place.

What data has lead us to this theory if not the simple fact that we as a species cannot fathom the complete loss of our being? I think most of us just dont want to accept this as a possibility. Therefore throughout time we have created theories as to what 'might' happen in order to create a situation where death becomes easier to accept by saying we (in some altered state), continue on after we leave this realm.

Most would see this theory of the end being 'the end' primarily an 'athiest' view of death. But why?
Just because some ancient philosophical texts written at a time when human logic was pathetically simplistic reletive to what it has become today say that god will provide us a comfortable afterlife if we follow the teachings of cirtain 'so-called' enlightened humans?

To say we are repeatidly reborn is to say that our soul is eternal. And due to the human brain being a finite entitiy, we ofcourse cannot comphrehend eternity. Our main imperfection and what sets us aside from the devine deity that we believe created our universe and all its conditions for harbouring life is that our physical being is only here to experience an extremily tiny portion of time itself. For all we know, once were gone.........were gone... And everything that we once were simply remains a memory to those we leave behind as our physical being decomposes and essentually returns to the earth.

Whatever does happen after death, is ultimatly fairly trivial as it should play no major role in determining any portion of our fate in this physical plane we currantly exist within. I am comfortable with death, because I realise that its a part of life I have absolutly no control over, a final frontier if you will that we all must face at the end of our days and whether or not we will be reborn is inconsiquential to me as all I can do is wait and experience it when my time comes.

I'm sure there will be people out there who believe definitivly that reincarnation is what happens, some will believe heaven and hell (in a number of different forms) is the truth and ofcourse some will believe that the end of our lives, is the end of our existance compleatly.

But anyone who decides they know something like this to the point of being 100% sure is simply fooling themselves into a false sense of understanding for something they can never prove.

Much like religious 'faith'.

But thats another subject compleatly.....

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RIP jono, peace out bboy.
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In rebirth, the soul doesn't exist. If it does, it does not exist in the same way you are thinking of. Since in Buddhism, the "self" is seen as an illusion and actually non-existant, then a "soul" which contains the individual essence or spirit of a person would not make sense. Rather, what is passed on from any living being is its energy.

For example, say somebody dies, their body is decomposed which releases energy into the universe's pool of energy, which everything is made out of. When a life is conceived, the energy manifests to create the being.

Rebirth isnt like, you die and your soul is then born again as a cow or another person or whatever, somehow. Its more like when you light one candle with another. No actual substance is transferred between them, but one is the cause of the other. Or like a seed that turns into a sprout... The sprout is not the same as the seed, but without the seed the sprout could not have come into existence.

The population problem is not actually a problem. Since the energy for new life does not necessarily need to come from human life, the fact that the population is growing actually coincides with this theory in a way. As the population grows, plants, trees and animals perish, which are all also composed of energy which returns to the universe.

I agree with you about how we shouldnt be focusing on death anyway. I mean, in a way we experience death everyday. Think about yourself 10 years ago... Where is that person now? You have completely changed since then, who you were 10 years ago doesnt exist anymore, and will never exist again. Essentially that person is dead. 10 years from now, we will be completely different to how we are now and us as we know ourselves now wont exist anymore.

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Well.. Being that what you have said is only theoretical.. I cant really argue against any of it..

But in a way, that is essentually just supporting the theory that who we are, and everything that builds us as a human being simply ends when we die never to resurface again.

Its quite logical... But ofcourse, nothing is certain. This theory, like all others on the subject, is only a product of human imagination.

__________________
RIP jono, peace out bboy.
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Personally, I believe that the self is an illusion. Who we are and what builds us as a human being is bullshit in my opinion.

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All we have in this currant form of existance is who we are and what builds us as a human being..

Why should it be an illusion.......or irrelevant for that matter?

Who we are is who we are and we can never be sure if that will follow us into the afterlife or not.

You may as well just get used to the fact that for the period of time your here on this plane, who you are is always going to be an instrumental part of your self and understanding your purpose here on earth.

Like I said, its death thats irrelevant, not life. Because life is all we really have.

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RIP jono, peace out bboy.
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i feel a human soul is poerful enough to come back in any form conciously.

i mean, there are people that can control their out of body experiences.


the human soul is a powerhouse I don't think we have even a fraction of understanding or control of, much like the human brain.

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If I were to ask you who you were, what would you say? Who are you?

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I'd say I'm a rapper currantly living on the gold coast..

Why...What would you say?

"Oh I'm absolutly nothing cause who I am is a compleatly irrelevant illusion"[/wtf]

__________________
RIP jono, peace out bboy.
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Well it depends on how you look at things. Some believe actions and beliefs make the man. Although where the "illusion" comes in is probably when everyone has the ability to look at things different. Like I can look at the president and see a corrupt peice of shit who's tryin to take over the world. Where another person can think he's an honest man in a position of power. Who's right? Is the way Bush sees himself the only right thing? Who decides who "he" is? Him? If that's true then why do we have a collection opinion on sanity and morality? Just saying..

Where are you going?

What do you want?

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I'm going through the journey of life bruh...

What I want out of it is to leave a great legacy, hopefully continue my bloodline and take every peice of knowledge and experience I possibly can out of this lifetime I've been given by god.

__________________
RIP jono, peace out bboy.
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To most people: Don't read what I have written, dont read it at all. Not even a tiny bit of it. Just skip it, please.

I'll try to explain my standpoint.

OK. So you are Alex, a rapper living on the Gold Coast, going through the journey of life, who wants to leave a legacy, have kids, and learn as much as possible.

Isn't that a bit shallow? Does that really describe you, as who you truly feel you are? Is that vague description what makes you up as a person? Of course not. What you just told me actually means nothing. Thats not who you are. When I asked you who you were, what you told me was your name, your occupation, and your place of abode. WHO ARE YOU? I could nitpick at every answer you gave me, I could say "thats not who you are, what you've told me is your opinion on certain subjects" or "thats not who you are, what you've told me is your memory of what has made up your life up to this point." You could never tell me who you actually are. Do you even know who you are?

My "self," the same as everyone else's, is made up of thoughts, emotions, and memories. Nothing more. This self is a perception that we create. It can change, and is always changing. What if you hit your head and got Amnesia? Lost every memory. Didn't know your name, didn't know where you were, what you were doing, or wtf was going on... And I came along and said "who are you?" What would you say? You dont know? You are still the same person, but you are nothing like what you consider yourself now.

The self is an illusion, it is dynamic. What is behind the self, that is the true nature of who you are. Without the self, you are nothing. Nothing. Would that make you sad? What if you lost your self through amnesia. Would you feel sad? Would you miss your old self? You wouldn't. You wouldn't even know, it wouldn't bother you one bit. You would just continue to exist.

But you might say (actually you definitely will say -_- lmao) "wtf thats stupid, idiots get amnesia, the chance of that happening is so slim. What you are saying is illogical, because the self is there, I dont have amnesia, so right now there isnt a problem. I am who I am and im fine with that, its not an illusion to me." Well thats all very well and good, and true. What are the chances of you magically losing your sense of ego and self? Slim to none.

But this "nothing" that is left after the self is stripped. What about that? Your self might not magically be stripped from you, but through hard work and discipline, maybe one day you could lose your self and your ego and become nothing. Why would you want to become nothing? Because nothing is great.

Think of how much suffering your self and ego are causing you without you even knowing it. You want to become successful, you want to become rich, you are not those things so its making you suffer. You want to leave a legacy, think of how much you will suffer if you end up not being as successful as you had planned. When you're not having sex, you want to have sex, then you have sex, but after it its not long before you want it again. If someone insults you, your ego is hurt, if someone degrades you your pride is shattered. All these things you want, and all these things you dont want are causing you to suffer. Want is desire, desire is longing, and longing is suffering. The self is a troublesome thing.

Why would you want to become "nothing," so to speak, to lose your self and your ego? Well, its obvious. Without those things, you would be content. You wouldnt want anything, you would just exist. That is true happiness. You probably can't even comprehend what it would be like. It is, complete comfort, like when you are wearing a comfortable pair of pants or shoes it feels like they arent there, they don't bother you at all. Imagine being comfortable with everything, nothing bothers you at all. Nothing is a virtue or a curse, nothing is an advantage or a disadvantage, which reminds me of a story I heard.

There was once an old farmer, who lost his horse. Everyone in town came to his house and said "Oh, we're so sorry you lost your horse. Thats terrible." The farmer said "Maybe." The next day his horse returned with seven other wild horses, and everyone in town came to his house and said "We are so happy for you! Isn't it wonderful you have eight horses now?" He said "maybe." The next day his son was trying to tame one of the wild horses, but was thrown off and broke his leg. Everyone in town came to the farmers house and said "We are so sorry about your son breaking his leg, it was such bad luck." He replied "maybe." The next day conscription officers came to the town, looking for suitable people to recruit to fight in the war. They didn't recruit the farmers son because he had a broken leg. Everyone in town came to his house and said "Isn't it lucky your son didn't have to go and fight in the war because of his broken leg?" ... "Maybe," replied the farmer.

You see what I mean? It's this atittude, this way of existence. It includes, but is not limited to, all the things I have mentioned. Your mind is like a mirror. Nothing is retained or kept, but nothing is refused. You can see things so clearly with an empty mind. You would see things exactly as they are.

One of the (great) sayings of one particular man who reached this state of being was something like "Before it, my ears heard whatever they wanted to hear, my eyes saw whatever they wanted to see, my feet moved wherever they wanted to go, and my mind thought whatever it wanted to think. After it, my ears heard whatever they wanted to hear, my eyes saw whatever they wanted to see, my feet moved wherever they wanted to go, and my mind thought whatever it wanted to think." That probably makes no sense to anyone, but I think its fucking great. The guy was obviously so wise. What he's saying is that before he obtained enlightenment, he was as undisciplined as the rest of us, only doing what he wanted, without any self-control. He witnessed events as an observer, and after the events he remembered them and thought about them, and said "well yes, those events had quite an impression on me." After he obtained enlightenment, he just existed. Instead of witnessing events as an observer, it was as if he, the observer, was merely observing life from a particular point of view.

It's like saying that there is no difference between the knower and the known or the thinker and the thought, as opposed to the common belief that the knower and the known or the thinker and the thought are two different things. Your mind, if you have one, is not in your head. Your head is in your mind.

If you asked me who I was, I honestly wouldn't be able to give you a proper answer.

If you asked me where I was going, I would say I was going to bed now.

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If you have an egg.

And you take away the shell and the insides.

You have nothing.

But what your philosophies are failing to realise is that the shell and the insides is what made up the egg in the first place.

Granted, yes.. I gave you fairly superficial answers to your questions. But thats because I cant really be bothered typing a story on who I am and what makes me the way I am or what drove me to be the person I am today.

You know me.. I am a logical person.

If I didnt achieve the goals I want to achieve before I die. Its not going to make me sad at all, because I live by the will of god and anything that happens over the course of my fate is inevidibly what fits in with his plan.

I believe in god not by faith, but because I dont believe there is any logical reason for the conditions of this universe and more locally, this planet to be so perfectly arranged for us without the intervention of a deity. I have seen his workings occur in every day life, times when I've prayed for guidance, and boom the very next day I go through new thought patterns which lead me to new conclusions.

Ultimatly, my life here on earth is who I am. My memories and experiences are what was inevidibly given to me by god and what will end up defining my purpose. It would be stupid of me to believe what he has given me is worthless, or irrelevant.

Thats why, while I can find a level of respect for your opinions and philosophies, I dont nessecarily agree with them.

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RIP jono, peace out bboy.
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