So of course, when we humans try to order it we fail. Chaos is good.

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Failed?

Or do you actually mean not succeeded yet due to the currant level of technology?

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RIP jono, peace out bboy.
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Nope, we will never be able to order things... Its just the way the universe works. We try, but it turns out as a sort of pseudo-ordered chaos.

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We build technology to make things easier and figuer problems out like diseases and sickness. But then we fuck shit up for later generations like....Fuel....good for cars and traveling and makes life easy right....kills the fuck out the ozone and helps create the green house effect....Either we fail now or later....but in the end we will fail as a whole coz we war on each other rather then on Chaos itself

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figure I could drop by and promote my my first mixtape and what not since im here..

We'll never be able to beat chaos.

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I can beat chaos....

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RIP jono, peace out bboy.
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OK, name one instance of you beating chaos, and I guarantee there will still be chaos in what you have done.

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Hypothetical --

I run a library, books are just stacked all over the floor and in absolutly no particular order.

Sollution-- I construct shelves to go all around my library with a definitive order in which books are placed around the shop with a legend on the wall so anybody entering my library can figure out exactly what they want and pick up their book without too much effort....

Where once there was chaos, now there is order.

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RIP jono, peace out bboy.
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And in your order, there is chaos. A natural base state of chaos that, no matter what, can't be beaten. Books on shelves. What about the countless dust particles all over them, all in a random position? What about the vast array of colors of books, all random, and the light and dark on the books, its all totally random. Even your position next to the books and shelves. What are you in the universe? What could possibly be more random than a nos being right there right then in the entire scope of existence? Huh? And you're telling me order is 100% feasible in this world?!

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Dust particles on books?

Bro the spreading of dust itself is a systematic phenomenon that has been happening for all recorded history and is a minature part of a larger whole of a natural equilibrium that we live in..

Colors, random sizes? That has nothing to with chaos, that is a human decision that has been made for each seperate book. When were talking books, the most definitive information required to decypher what book we are looking for is the name and the author. Therefore this is where the order of the library system defeats chaos and creates an ordered system based on the books most important information.

My place in the universe is defined by a number of infinitly small particles gathered together and condensed tightly all at a certain point on a 3D point graph, be it a graff consisting of the legth of the entire universe vertically and horizontally or be it a graph of a small area surrounding the earth. Being that I am an organism constructed to be solid matter, my position is ofcourse important to me.. The relevance of the exact point I'm in relating to the universe is that I will not be.........say.....halfway through a wall... Where is the order you ask?

Cause and effect. I am standing here because I run a library, why do I run a library? I like books and want to make a living that way. Why do I like books? I possibly found an interest in learning at a young age which caused me to read books a lot. Why did that happen? Because I may have been brought up in a family that had a lot of interesting books I could read. Why did they have a lot of books? Maybe my family had traveled a lot and good reading material for long trips..................And you could go on forever.

Cause and effect IS order. Just like apexx was saying in his post.....Why does the tree grow as it does? Because a lot of its defining aspects are implanted into the seed itself to create an order that is required by this tree to survive and reproduce.

I AM telling you order is a perfectly logical concept that has been proven over time to work unfailably.

Dont you get it man?

Surly your not gonna come back and keep arguing that there is only chaos now right?

Thatd be embarrasing..............for you.....

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RIP jono, peace out bboy.
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deep shit
nos and ter should have a talk show together early in the morning
where they just sip coffee and debunk all of lifes mysteries
plus
given the state of the world today
chaos is an understatement

there is no such thing as chaos, it's all order.

there's a system and intention for everything. your failure to observe is the only chaos.

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OK... Whats an example?

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look anywhere around you. look at any patern found in nature. billions of plants replicate, yet they're all the same - no one has to tell them,no one hasto teach them, or paint them. the same numer of leaves, same number of ridges on each leaf etc all coded into each seed. every tree has rings to mark each year. all birds are inherently sensitive to mangnetic fields which guide them in flight. every natural eco system has a balance and every organism plays an equally important role toward keeping that balance. the golden ratio is found in everything from a sea shell to the human body, to a spiral galaxy. etc etc etc etc nothing is random.

i could go on and on. there is no chaos, only order. everything happens for a reason. when it fulfills that reason you call it chaos. why? because you don't understand why it happens.

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You can clone a plant by taking some clippings and putting them in soil. But is the new plant exactly the same as the parent plant? Of course not. Sure, two trees might have the same leaf structure or something. But are any two leaves on either plant the same? Even on the same plant? What is more chaotic than the placement of leaves on a tree? What could possibly be more random than that? They just... happen... No scientist can determine exactly what a seed will look like as a tree, even if they have deeply studied that species of tree and the effect of external factors on phenotype. They might have a general idea, but they still wont know.

Rings in the trunk... What about the number of rings? Is there order in how long a tree lives?

How could there be no chaos? Forget chaos being a bad thing, thats just some conception we made. Chaos is wherever you look. You existing is chaotic. wtf are you doing there at this time in that place? What are you in the universe? If you took a picture (not in the two-dimensional sense) of every single thing that exists right at this moment... Where is the order in that?

"Well obviously this happened and that happened meaning this chemical reaction occured causing this to be there, and that car was there in the street because that woman was going grocery shopping and her hand is near her face because she was about to scratch her head and that bird was here because of this and that leaf was slanted because of the speed and direction of the wind etc etc etc"

But why? Why were things exactly like that in exactly the right conditions to produce that exact snapshot of the universe? There is no reason why... Things are just there. You can make a reason why, but whats the reason for that reason to be there? If you follow that path of logic you'll end up at the beginning of the universe. What began the universe? Well if you're a big bang person, a big bang created the universe. A random bang in non-existence, completely arbitrarily coming out of infinite nothingness and eternal void, just BANG out of nowhere creating the universe.

Of course, we dont know what began the universe. But you get my point... hopefully. -_-

By the way, how could you or I understand why something happens?

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